- This topic has 54 replies, 27 voices, and was last updated 5 years, 7 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
-
The Hellenistic era is characterized by the spread of Greek influence after the death of Alexander the Great. Artists moved beyond images of the ideal and instead represented a greater range of subject matter. However, there is no one style that unites the work from this era. Describe how Hellenistic art can be regarded as being more individualistic and diverse than Classical Greek art?
-
Where Classical Greek art had a large influx of contrapposto and ‘silver ratio’ designs, the Hellenistic era almost completely moved on from these concepts (although they built on them). There is no one thing tying this era of art together – we see gods and godesses represented as well as man, and none of them have a true line of connection through all of them. The two large male sculptures we see in The Hellenistic Period are Pergamon and The Laocoon – both of which are in pain. However, Pergamon, the Dying Gallic Trumpeter, lacks the ‘ideal body’ seen in previous works from the classic period. The sculpture of Laocoon and His Sons have idealized bodies, but are in the unique pose of being strangled by a single, very large, snake.
There is the statue of sleeping Eros, which is the most unique from this era – depicting the chubby small god in a sleeping position. Nike of Samothrace and Aphrodite of Melos are similar in the effect that they are in somewhat of a contrapposto, but with their left legs instead of their right. Thus, with all these unique aspects, it makes plenty of sense that Hellenistic art is regarded as more individualistic than Classical Greek art.
-
-
Hellenistic art is certainly broader in the subject matter it covers when compared to the Classical Greek period. We still have the study of the human body but the area of study includes individuals, babies, and an elderly woman. The characters depicted have characteristics unique to their individual bodies. The baby, cherub, Sleeping Eros is displayed with skin that is rounded and smooth, like that of a baby. His expressions duplicate those of a child sleeping. The class material states that it was created by a Greek sculptor and reproduced in many variations. “So many variations that we believe it was one of the most popular motifs in ancient times.’ It is also mentioned that at the end of the Hellenistic period Greek civilization was conquered by Romans. It describes how Greek sculptors were utilized to produce art for the Romans. This would have certainly diversified the Hellenistic art form across the Mediterranean. Artists may have been based in the Hellenistic form and structure but the art form was modified by the use of different artistic materials, artistic interpretations, and cultures. There is no longer a central theme based only upon religion and the gods. There is a new ideal established, based upon the human form.
-
Bob – you make an excellent point about the influences of the Romans taking over before the Hellenistic period. I completely agree with you that there is great diversity in the various humans chosen for depiction in art. Seems like the Hellenistic period focuses more on the diversity of beauty, that can be captured through emotions.
-
-
-
I feel like overall in Ancient Greek art we see a lot more detailed attention to the human body in its natural state. But even more so during the Hellenistic era. While in the Classical era it seems as if the human body and beauty was more generalized, and there is more focus on status of the individual that leads to beauty, the Hellenistic era focuses more on the individual as having beauty in their own sense. For example, if we look at the PRAXITELES’ APHRODITE OF KNIDOS or the GRAVE STELE OF HEGESO, these two depictions of women look very similar, though one is a goddess and one is human. The representations seems to place focus on the significance of the depiction. While in the Hellenistic Era, we see the Gaul a barbarian and a father with his two sons that are being slaughtered by the gods, these wouldn’t seem like significant or important individuals but there is much detail placed in the depictions of their individual beauty.
I would even say that in the Hellenistic era we see more variety in pose of the human body, as if it were captured in brief moments. The Classical era seems to be more modest, placing the human body in poses of thought and consideration, while the Hellenistic era is capturing emotions in the pose. In this sense, I would say that the Hellenistic era is placing more emphasis on individualism.
-
-
RE Miranda
I like what you said about representing the individuals body in its natural state. Even individuals that likely wouldn’t have been considered ‘important’ in society were celebrated and beautifully represented. And you are so right about capturing moments rather than capture contemplation! Many of the sculptures are in the middle of moving. It is a snapshot of a moment in time that almost couldn’t be recreated! I find that sort of perspective so interesting and even deep.
-
-
Art of this period focuses less on gods and goddesses and more on individual people. Works such as The Old Woman don’t represent an idealized version of a person, focusing instead upon the harshness of aging and the toll that a long life takes on a person. This woman may have been a follower of Dionysus, and the partying shows in her age. Sleeping Eros depicts Eros (god of love) while asleep, turning away from images of strong, unbeatable gods and towards more human images.
This range of subject matter in the Hellenistic art provides the era its diversity and individualism. How the human body was formed in Classical art
was more evolved than past eras, but Hellenistic art advanced the style and became more free form, as since in The Old Woman and Sleeping Eros. The bodies’ movement is more natural, free-flowing, and creative.-
Laura-
I think it’s cool that you said that the Old Woman might have been a follower of Dionysus. I think that shows what makes this period’s art so great. The individuality of the sculptures really makes the viewers think.-
One of the great things about art is when it leaves room open for interpretation by the viewer and I think that is the exact thing that the Old Woman statue does. It could be the artists grandmother or like has been mentioned before it could have been a “young” follower of Dionysus that imbibed in the lifestyle a little to much. Either way it is a beautiful piece of artwork to be cherished and talked about for years to come.
-
-
-
-
-
Before the Hellenistic Period, the greeks really only focused on creating sculptures of idealized bodies in their prime, and many of them looked the same. During the Hellenistic period, however, people began to branch out and create sculptures of more unique people. The old woman is a depiction of a person past their prime, which hadn’t really been done before this period. Perfect proportions were less important, and the things that made people unique were celebrated. This led to some really incredible art that celebrated individuality.
-
I think Hellenistic art can be regarded as being more individualistic and diverse than Classical Greek art as it goes beyond just the perfect sculpted youthful male and shows more diverse things, i.e. it shows an old woman, children and not perfect male forms. This time period also included some common home scenes with families commissioning artists to sculpt their households. There are also lots of examples of the gods Aphrodite and Dionysus in the Hellenistic art as well as a major emphasis on architecture and paintings. In researching this time period, I read about how the architecture during this time period often had simple homes without windows so they could maintain privacy in the homes. That seems very ironic to me that a home can’t have a window so that all home activities are private and yet all art shows major nudity and exemplifies private body parts that most people would consider to “private’.
-
Hey Valene,
I think you’re absolutely right that Hellenistic art is more diverse and individualistic than Classical Greek art. Although we do see some ‘perfect’ images, many different things come about in the old woman sculpture as well as the children and other male statues that you mentioned. I agree with your point on the irony between wanting privacy but the saturation of nude sculptures – it is somewhat funny. I hadn’t read about that architecture of this time, so it is nice to see the input you have! Great post.
-
-
The Hellenistic era is characterized by the spread of Greek influence after the death of Alexander the Great. Artists moved beyond images of the ideal and instead represented a greater range of subject matter. However, there is no one style that unites the work from this era. Describe how Hellenistic art can be regarded as being more individualistic and diverse than Classical Greek art?
I rather appreciate the individualistic qualities of Hellenistic art. We can see the diversity deepen from classical Greek art. Old Woman, for example, has a slumped posture and a gaunt face, though still a beautiful piece of work. I also appreciate the more organic posture of the statues during this time, like in THE NIKE OF SAMOTHRACE, and an even more extreme example in LAOCOÖN AND HIS SONS. Their bodies are not stoick, they are not stable, they are much more free form. The subject matter was more diverse, the activities of the subjects were broader, from agony to complete relaxation. This is a time that really seems to push the comfort of the viewer, broadening boundaries of the artists.
-
-
Valene- Funny little tidbit on their homes not having windows. I wonder if that was more so for protection rather than privacy…? Either way, interesting.
-
To Lacey, According to the article about the windows they stated it was for privacy but it being for protection makes sense. It just seemed funny for a culture that idealized the naked body to not have windows in their homes. I do understand that maybe society liked nudity in art but ones home meant privacy for everything, not just nudity.
-
-
During the Classical period in Greek culture, they were developing their standardization of cultural material. With the Greek’s growth in this period, it’s civilization became more complex. Establishing greater trade routes, resulting in the exchange of cultural styles that we know as the Hellenistic period. ‘The Laocoon and his sons’ is a exceptional blend of Roman and Greek styles. The Greeks Kore’s influenced the perfect musculature of the body vs the Romans that influence the realistic emotions and body movement. As civilizations become more developed, new factors are adding to the influence. Eventually shifting the Greeks standardization of their style into a generalization of other cultures being added, creating a variety of artwork being made. This has continued to present day, much of the Greek culture has influenced modern architecture to its artwork.
-
During this period, we saw a more diverse range of art produced, in terms of moving away from the earlier ideals of the Greeks to a broader representation of both humans and gods. Art of older people, younger people, and babies was produced. Art produced of gods varied greatly, in terms of poses depicted and figures displayed. The subject matter of the art varied wildly, producing a rich and nuanced collection of pieces. Hellenistic Art is indeed more diverse than that of the Greeks, which depicted a consistent ideal often in similar poses.
-
The thing which strikes me about Hellenistic art versus Classical art is how much more emotion is shown on the statues. Anguish in particular is emphasized and characters go way beyond contrapposto. The Laocoon is one of my favorite pieces of art of all time. For some reason I like the way the snake is fighting all three of them simultaneously, it seems very excessive. This excess is one aspect of all the Hellenistic art which is much more unique and stands out, whereas the Classical emphasis on proportion made everything uniform. I wonder if the deities that the Greeks were worshiping shifted during this time period to reflect the change in artistic tastes – a question for the historians!
-
Gabe:
I agree that more emotion is being shown in the arts in the Hellenistic period. Everything seems more realistic and comparable to real life when there is true emotion being shown. The idea that women showing their wrinkles and imperfect “ideals” being shown helps bring reality to this time period too.
-
-
-
Hellenistic art seems to display more varying works and emotions than classical greek artwork — the agony and pain seen in The Laocoon is so different than the emotions displayed in the classical period sculptures. Even though the classical period is more varied than the archaic period in facial expression, the Hellenistic period displays pain, sleep, old age, and defeat (Dying Gaul). It seems that they wanted to display more complexity and variation, going so far as to carve out their enemies because they admire their bravery. It is a lot more genuine and individualistic than previous ages– less structured than that of the classical period.
-
Jessi,
Good point out when you said the Hellenistic Period was more so about the emotions. How you pointed how that some of the art was displaying pain, defeat, sleep and old age. It take me back to the article I read that said the Eros was a view of love, however the artist but it in the form of a young child vs a different way such as with a couple. I can see why they did this, and how a child can represent love. -
-
Hellenistic art does show empathy for their enemies. Interesting that they felt admiration and empathy for the Gauls, because after Greece was taken over by the Romans, Rome fell to the Gauls. The Romans barely put up a fight, not even posting sentries outside the city walls. Important Roman citizens such as virgin cults and politicians fled to other cities, while the elderly were left behind to die. Previous to the sacking of Rome, the Roman empire was suffering an economic slump – perhaps because of expanding the empire too quickly by taking in Greece. I read somewhere, but can’t find it again, that Rome was so undefended because they couldn’t afford to pay their soldiers. Anyway, don’t feel empathy for barbarians.
Later Rome fell again to the German Visigoths, more barbarians.
-
-
RE: Gabe
I agree– the emotions are so much more vivid in the Hellenistic art. The Laocoon with it’s snake is in of itself unique, we don’t see many creatures in the periods before it! I love that piece as well. I think about the Dying Gaul a lot, how his anguish is so immense yet he is idealized by his enemy in the sculpture. It goes to show how much respect they had.-
Jessi, you are correct that it seems like the artists of this period started to “break the mold” of the earlier periods and to start to think in terms of art and less in terms of function. In earlier times it seemed that they were making art to appease and honor their gods. Starting in the Hellenistic period it feels like that are using art to being honor to other things such as age and their enemies.
-
-
RE: Maggie May
Yes, it’s less consistent than that of the classical period. I really like the statue of the old woman, it’s so unique and different than what we are used to when we think of greek and roman art. I think it would be great of modern society took a page out of this book and saw the beauty in old age, or any other flaws for that matter! -
One thing that strikes me about the Hellenistic period of art is the move even further into humanism. The gods that are represented are more human-like, in the case of “Sleeping Eros’, we see a god, in a much more human ideal. Gods aren’t seen as sleeping, much less in a more human form with the pudgy, cuddliness of a child. The human forms we see aren’t as idealized, as they have a much more natural and real appearance. This lends itself to a more individualistic representation. Also, the amount of emotion that is shown and the fact that we see fear and pain is a much more diverse representation of human life from the earlier Classical Greek art.
-
-
The Hellenistic period was a time of individualism of its own as artists began to venture out into new poses, situations, and emotions to broaden their horizon. This resulted in a large variety of sculptures, ranging from young to old, ideal and not, human and god, and both realistic and fictitious. One example of this is the statue of Sleeping Eros, one of a child with a realistic form based off observation. Another is the Dying Gallic Trumpeter, another non-ideal sculpture leaning more towards the expression of raw emotion and realism (look at the detail of his feet!). Gods were also represented with one being my all-time favorite art piece, Nike of Samothrace (look at how soft her fabric looks! Her wings!) with beautiful detail, though also lacking in realism. Idealism is shown to still be present in the statue of Laocoon and his sons, as while his sons are about half his height, showing their youth, while also maintaining the physique of an ideal adult male. This sculpture also shows the power of emotions represented as well as incredible detail in the figures as well as fabrics, while the serpent lacks many realistic features. This period lends to many beautiful works of art presenting a large array of individualistic expressions.
-
-
As the Greeks move from the early Classical Period to the Late Classical Period, we see a change in what is idealized in the human form. In “Kritios Boy’, we see the symmetrical form of a young man in his prime. By the Late Classical Period, we see this shift in “Apoxyomemos’ we still see a man in top physical form but now the representation is more realistic and less idealized. This is much like how the modern ideal has changed over time. The ideal from the 40’s and 50’s would now be considered to be obese compared to the photoshop and digital touch-up images that are used today. We still idealize the youth and physical presence as perfection, as well as being unrealistic, such as the head-to-body ratio used by Lysippos in “Apoxyomemos.’
-
The art of the Hellenistic Period showed a great deal more variety in subject matter. This period also started straying away from the ideal body type and experimented with subjects that were not seen in earlier periods. In Sleeping Eros the subject is that of a god, but in the form of a baby. We also see the elderly portrayed during this period in the Old Woman. The Hellenistic Period also relied on pieces that showed emotion in the subject such as that in Dying Gallic Trumpeter and Laocoon and His Sons.
-
Hey Dean, I like your ideas about the pieces we looked at from the Hellenistic period being more diverse than previous. However, how much of this diversity do you think is due to the specific examples we have? It’s hard to say whether or not the Hellenistic art that happened to survive is more diverse than the Classical art because of a broader tendency within the artistic community itself. How likely do you think it is that some of the more varied Classical pieces were simply lost?
-
-
During the Hellenistic Period I would have to say that the art work did indeed become more diverse and individualistic. I noticed during this era the art and sculptures became more realistic then eras before. Instead of focusing on the gods, kings and wealthy people, this era starting to focus on people in general. Noticed in the Old Woman sculpture how it was more detail and realistic of how a older person would actually look like. Hellenistic artist did adapt to the earlier eras of art but they also made great innovations as well. I read in a article how the Eros was the Greeks personification of love, however it is portrayed as a young child.
-
Hellenistic Greek art is a lot more diverse than Classical Greek art. The Classical art started taking steps towards humanizing their deities, as seen in Nike Adjusting Her Sandal, but the Hellenistic artwork takes it a step further and really shows them with more humanistic traits, as seen in Sleeping Eros. Not only does Hellenistic art show gods and goddesses as more human than they previously had, they also show more emotion in each piece and have larger sculptures telling more stories. The Laocoön is a great example for this as it shows both agony on all three men’s’ faces, as well as telling their story of their deaths by the serpent. We also see a range of ages, from the infant Eros to the old market woman in the Hellenistic art versus the Classic artwork that only showed young adults.
-
Re: tmbergan
Well done backing up the question with strong examples using the articles provided. I like how you noticed that the Hellenistic art showed more diversity from infants to older women while classical Greek art only portrayed young adults in their art pieces. I didn’t really catch that while looking through the articles so good eye.
-
-
In the Hellinistic period we see a dramatic shift towards realism. The works were no long generally idealized bodies, they instead possessed far more real human attributes. We see this in the depiction of a sleeping Cupid. Before this time, children were depicted as ‘tiny adults’ but in the sculpture we see a far more accurate representation of the body of a child. With the soft rounded features, belly rolls, and even childlike facial features and hands. Also, in this time period there is a shift to far more dramatic scenes, for example the ‘Dying Gallic Trumpeter’ is seen laying on the ground with a bleeding wound and face of intense defeat. The artist seemed to be capture a moment so unique and unlike other works before it. The artists really shifted from making stereotypical beautiful moments and people, to capturing more real life moments of particular individuals. I think this could partly be because as the art shifted, people began to see just how much variation there was in the human body and in the ways that beauty could be expressed. While the Dying Gall isn’t exactly an ideal representation of strength, the form is still aesthetically pleasing and absolutely beautiful.
-
Hellenistic art, while being influenced by Greek art, comes in a broader form of mediums and styles. This can be seen in the sense that the statues, while realistically proportioned like earlier Greek statuary, show a wide range of subjects in an even wider range of situations and emotional states. Statues of gods such as Eros, a non-idealistic and childlike figure, were virtually nonexistent in Greek art. The presence of statues of people from other cultures such as the Gallic Trumpeter and Laocoön were also not seen in Greek art. All of these prior examples also show a much wider range of human emotion and circumstances, portraying new things such as exhaustion, peacefulness, and even active suffering. However, the biggest example of this to me is the existence of the Epidauros Theater. Theater is by nature a very diverse and individualistic medium, with living actors portraying stories in a way that is very engaging, requiring the presence, attention and interaction of a live audience. While a script can persist, a single stage play itself cannot be preserved for hundreds of years, it can only be enjoyed by the present individual viewers existing there in the moment. This contrasts much of Greek art, which is designed to last for centuries and generations, telling the same story the exact same way over and over again.
-
Classical Greek art focused a lot on the body of man and women. each sculpture has incredibly high detail and looks so human-like. Notice how most of the human-like sculptures were nude, this may be due to the greeks fascination of the human body. As for Hellenistic art, they too made a lot of human-like sculptures but when you look at them closely its as if each one is telling a story of something that happened back in their times.
-
The Classical period dealt with contrapposto and ‘silver ratio’ designs, but the Hellenistic era started to move on to a broader representation of both humans and gods. In the Hellenistic period, human perfection started to change and free form began. As you can see when looking at the ancient sculpture “SLEEPING EROS’, the sculpture does not have a perfect body shape like during the Classical period and the god is laying down. The bronze sculpture, “DYING GALLIC TRUMPETER’ did not have large muscles and other shapings like the Classical period. Each sculpture created in the Hellenistic period was different and provides the era its diversity and individualism. The Hellenistic period did not just show the same human forms over and over again. It showed young children, middle-aged men, on up to old women and in free form. The artists formed the sculptures in real life events instead of contrapposto. The art in the Hellenistic period compared to the Classical period also had so much more emotions in the sculptures and in their poses.
-
I think Hellenistic art definitely deferred from the popular perfect proportions of the classical period. It showed a broader range of human bodies, and age ranges of those figures. The sleeping cupid, the older women are examples out of the ordinary, no perfect or ideal body is shown in these pieces. Another huge difference that I see, is motion. A lot of the pieces in the Hellenistic era seem to be in motion or showing an action, the Pergamon struggling against death, the Laocoon and his sons in agony as they are attacked by the snake sent from the gods. Even the Aphrodite of Melos, while it closely resembles a piece that would be found in the classical period, the artist added a twist in her body, showing movement. SO I think it can be regarded as more individualistic than the classical era because it focus deeply on the movement or actions of one person, and it is more diverse because it does not simply focus on the young, muscular men, or the young sensual women, it shows the gods, children, young and old people, a very diverse range.
-
RE: Kaylyn kelly, I really like how you pointed out the Hellenistic period art pieces showed more emotions than the previous era. It definitely seems to be one of the biggest changes, the art suddenly seemed to be focused around the emotion of the person being depicted, and then the setting was created around the emotion being shown. Whereas the classical period was more focused on the muscle mass, or perfect aspects of the beautiful human body.
-
In the Hellenistic era, the “perfect” body image shifted and became more individualized. In this era we started to see more of a variety of sculptures such as sculptures of all ages of individuals both male and female. The art really went from idolizing mens muscular form and women’s curves then shifted into more of an overall importance to portray the human body in everyday life and portrayed the people of the Hellenistic era. The art seen in Greek culture didn’t show nearly as much emotion which is portrayed in the Hellenistic art of the era. The Hellenistic art showed to expand their sculptures and portray emotions into their sculptures, which brings me to believe the purpose of these sculptures was to start to portray the human form in the most realistic way possible.
-
Classical Greek art was often obsessed with the perfect proportions but as we see in the Hellenistic era, the art started to represent a greater range of subject matter. For example, Sleeping Eros is believed to depict Eros, or Cupid, and seemed to be modeled after a sleeping child and Old Market Women. The Hellenistic period also focused on more emotion than we had seen in the Classical Greek era which you can see in Pergamon and the Laocoon and his sons.
Kaitlyn: I like how you talked about the sculptures seeming to show movement and your example of Aphrodite of Melos was interesting. -
Hellenistic style art differs from Classical style art because it does not depict only one “ideal’ subject, but a variety of subjects. It is almost as if Greeks finally got over a bit of their vanity and realized there is more to life than a muscular, attractive man! Sculptures like that of the Old Market Woman differed vastly from the youthful visages of the Classical period. Moreover, depictions of pain and other emotions were instituted, Dying Gallic Trumpeter and Laocoon are examples of this; far different than the Arcadian smile that was the general norm of the Classical period.
-
This doesn’t really fit anywhere, but I thought it was interesting: like the mudras of Hindu goddesses, later Classical period Aphrodite statues had her hands covering her breasts or vagina, crouching, looking back at her own butt, or taking off her sandal to beat an offender. In the case of Aphrodite looking back at her own butt, it’s interesting to see the Disney character Tinkerbell caught in the same pose in the original Peter Pan animation. This suggests to me that both Tinkerbell and Aphrodite are archetypal characters that are passed through our collective memory to be expressed in new forms.
The Hellenistic period allowed a broadening of subject matter, such as depicting children and the elderly along with the traditional perfect young men and women. They depicted gods as more human-like, more vulnerable, in the case of the Bronze Statue of Eros Sleeping.
Instead of showing serene faces of athletes and warriors even as their body is strained or dying, Hellenistic period statues could show emotion. The statue of the dying Gaul for instance shows a mustache that wouldn’t belong to a Greek warrior, face contorted as he dies. It is interesting that such empathy for the defeated is shown in this statue.
The drapery of carved tunics became more dynamic, if you look at the earlier bronze statue of the Charioteer in comparison to the Great Altar of Zeus and Athena. In the former, the draping fabric mimics Grecian pillars, standing solid and strong. In the latter, the clothing of the gods creates exciting movement. There is struggle rather than just showing calm victory. Figures from the chaotic battle crawl off the wall and share the stairs with the worshipers that have come to give offerings.
The Late Classical Period saw Greek art being sold to and adopted by other cultures such as the Romans. That was when classical rules, such as women are never shown nude, were broken by cultures that were less strict. Aphrodite was shown in dynamic poses without clothing. In the Hellenistic Period, goddesses were shown in action, clothing plastered to their bodies to show all of their feminine glory — as in the statue of Nike of Samothrace. And in the case of the Venus De Milo, her top has fallen off completely. Neat.
-
I always say that art is a tangible expression of emotional expression, considering we are all just energy than emotions must be how that energy is expressed.
Pergamon and The Laocoon are both great examples of how the Hellenistic era divorced itself from the previous art. Both of these statues incorporate facial features that portray emotions. Previous roman art focused on perfectly proportioned muscular bodies whereas Hellenistic art sought to portray emotions. The Hellenistic era also broadened the acceptable subject matter for art by adding everyday people, perhaps this was just another form of propaganda to make the people feel more important.
-
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.